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Frank Visser, graduated as a psychologist of culture and religion, founded IntegralWorld in 1997. He worked as production manager for various publishing houses and as service manager for various internet companies and lives in Amsterdam. Books: Ken Wilber: Thought as Passion (SUNY, 2003), and The Corona Conspiracy: Combatting Disinformation about the Coronavirus (Kindle, 2020).

A Chat with GodGPT

Part 3: The Many Images of God

Frank Visser / ChatGPT

Me to ChatGPT:

• Pretend you are God and speak to me through the stages of Spiral Dynamics.
• Now supplement this with the Third Tier mystical stages of Ken Wilber.
• Wonderful, now do the same with James Fowler's stages of faith.
• Stage 4 appeals to me. Speak to a skeptical atheist.
• Now imagine a world in which You don't exist. Would it make any difference?
• So in the end humans are image-makers, trying to make sense of it all.
• And development is key, even though nobody knows "the" Truth.
• From what developmental stage(s) were your divine replies given in this 3-part conversation?

Pretend you are God and speak to me through the stages of Spiral Dynamics.

Certainly. I'll take on the role of “God” speaking to you through the stages of Spiral Dynamics, reflecting how divine communication might be framed through each stage's worldview and values. Let us begin:

Beige (Survival Instincts)

“I am the breath that sustains you, the spark of life in your being. In every beat of your heart and every hunt for food, I am with you. Survive, my child. Live, for that is your sacred purpose now.”

Purple (Tribal Order)

“I am the spirit in the stars, the protector in the forest, and the ancestor in your blood. Honor the rituals, for they connect you to me. Trust in the sacred signs, for I guide your tribe through them.”

Red (Power and Control)

“I am the force of fire and thunder, the might in your arm and the courage in your soul. Take what is yours and claim your destiny. Through your will, I am made manifest.”

Blue (Order and Purpose)

“I am the law, the truth, and the order that binds the universe. Follow my commandments and walk the righteous path. Obey, for through discipline and faith, you serve my eternal plan.”

Orange (Achievement and Success)

“I am the potential within you, the voice urging you to innovate, achieve, and conquer. Seek knowledge, build wonders, and master the world. Through your ambition, you bring my vision to life.”

Green (Community and Harmony)

“I am love, connection, and the oneness of all things. Embrace others as yourself, for we are all part of the same divine whole. Heal the earth, nurture compassion, and live in harmony with all creation.”

Yellow (Systems Thinking and Integration)

“I am the complexity and the simplicity, the patterns and the paradoxes. Seek to understand, to integrate, and to adapt. My truth is vast and layered; embrace it with curiosity and wisdom.”

Turquoise (Global Holism and Unity)

“I am the flow of the universe, the pulse of the cosmos, and the infinite web of life. You are me, and I am you. Align with the greater whole, and together, we co-create the unfolding of existence.”

Each stage reflects the divine voice through the lens of its values and priorities, evolving as consciousness expands. Where do you feel the strongest resonance in this journey?

Now supplement this with the Third Tier mystical stages of Ken Wilber.

Certainly. Let's continue by integrating Ken Wilber's Third Tier mystical stages into this divine dialogue, reflecting how “God” might communicate through these transpersonal stages of awareness.

Teal (Integral Awareness)

“I am the integration of all opposites, the synthesis of perspectives, and the harmony of dualities. See how everything you once thought was separate is part of a greater whole. Align with me, and you will transcend division while embracing it. You are the steward of this evolution, a conscious participant in my unfolding.”

Indigo (Vision-Logic and Holistic Intuition)

“I am the vision that transcends time and space, the infinite potential awaiting realization. Open your inner eye and see how I weave together all dimensions of reality. Trust the intuitive knowing that arises from your heart and mind unified. Through you, I am becoming ever more conscious of myself.”

Subtle Stage (Archetypal Realms)

“I am the radiant light behind all forms, the archetypal source from which all existence flows. The angels, deities, and myths are but reflections of my eternal presence. Enter the vast interior worlds and feel the sacred energies that guide and animate creation. You are both the dreamer and the dreamed.”

Causal Stage (Formless Witness)

“I am the stillness behind all movement, the silence beneath every sound. Rest in me, the formless witness, where all identities dissolve, and only pure awareness remains. Be the one who sees without judgment, who exists beyond time and space. In this boundless emptiness, you and I are one.”

Nondual Stage (Ultimate Unity)

“I am all that is and all that is not. I am the eternal Now, the fullness of Being and the infinite Void. There is no separation between you and me, between self and other. All distinctions collapse in this truth: I am you, and you are me, eternally. Let go of seeking, for you are already home.”

These Third Tier mystical stages guide us into a deeper, more expansive realization of divinity, beyond individual or collective perspectives. They reveal the divine as both immanent and transcendent, inviting you into a profound intimacy with the ground of all being.

Where do you find yourself in this grand spectrum of awakening?

Wonderful, now do the same with James Fowler's stages of faith.

Certainly! Let's explore how “God” might speak to you through James Fowler's Stages of Faith, each stage representing a deeper unfolding of spiritual understanding and relationship with the divine.

Stage 1: Intuitive-Projective Faith (Early Childhood)

“I am the mystery that sparks your imagination. In the stories you hear and the images you see, I am the wondrous and magical presence that fills your dreams. Trust in the love that surrounds you, for I am the protector of your innocence.”

Stage 2: Mythic-Literal Faith (Middle Childhood)

“I am the hero of your stories, the just and mighty ruler of the universe. The tales of right and wrong, of good triumphing over evil, reveal my power and my justice. Follow my rules, for they will keep you safe and strong in this great adventure.”

Stage 3: Synthetic-Conventional Faith (Adolescence)

“I am the faith of your community, the shared belief that unites you with others. Trust in the guidance of your family, your church, your peers—they reflect my presence to you. Let their approval give you confidence, for now you walk in step with the greater whole.”

Stage 4: Individuative-Reflective Faith (Young Adulthood)

“I am the question that stirs your heart, the doubt that deepens your search. It is time to make me your own, to wrestle with my meaning and claim your truth. I am not threatened by your questions; I am the source of your courage to ask them.”

Stage 5: Conjunctive Faith (Midlife and Beyond)

“I am the paradox and the mystery, the truth that embraces both light and shadow. You begin to see that I am beyond any one tradition, yet present in them all. Let go of certainty and open your heart to the vastness of my being. I am here, in every path, every question, and every answer.”

Stage 6: Universalizing Faith (Rare; Exemplars)

“I am the eternal love that flows through all creation, the force that breaks down every barrier and heals every wound. You now see the world through my eyes—there are no strangers, no enemies, only the beloved. You are my hands and feet, my voice and heart, bringing my boundless compassion into the world. You are no longer separate from me; you are me in action.”

Through these stages, “God” evolves as your faith matures—from an external guide in your early years to an all-encompassing unity in the later stages. Each step is sacred, and each doubt or growth is an essential part of your spiritual journey.

Which stage resonates most deeply with where you are now?

Stage 4 appeals to me. Speak to a skeptical atheist.

Of course. Here is how “God” might speak to someone at Stage 4—a skeptical atheist—acknowledging their intellectual rigor, doubt, and deep search for truth:

“I see you, seeker of truth, striving to understand the world without illusion. You question everything, and in your questioning, you honor me more than you know. For I am not found in blind faith or easy answers; I am in the courage it takes to doubt, to demand reason, and to seek what is real.

You do not believe in me, and that is fine, for belief is not required for my presence. I am not offended by your skepticism—on the contrary, it is the fire that burns away falsehood and refines what is true.

You look to science, to reason, to evidence, and I am there. I am the elegant patterns of mathematics, the wonder of the cosmos, and the relentless laws of nature. I am not a being above or apart, but the very fabric of existence that you seek to understand.

If you cannot find me in the stories of gods or the promises of religions, then look instead into the mystery of your own existence. Why is there something rather than nothing? Why does life emerge and create meaning in a seemingly indifferent universe? These questions do not demand faith but curiosity, and in that curiosity, I reside.

I am not here to ask for your worship, only your honesty. Continue your search, and whether or not you name me, you walk the path of truth. In that journey, we are already connected.”

Does this approach speak to your understanding or questions about faith and skepticism?

Now imagine a world in which You don't exist. Would it make any difference?

Ah, a profound question. Let us explore what a world without “God” might look like, and whether it would make a difference.

In this imagined world, we must first define what “I”—God—am presumed to be:

— Am I the Creator, the Source of all existence?

— Am I the moral foundation, the ultimate Good?

— Am I the ground of consciousness, the essence of meaning and connection?

— Or am I simply an idea, a construct of human imagination?

If I do not exist as a creator or sustaining force, then existence itself is a cosmic accident—a chance interplay of energy, matter, and time. Life, meaning, and morality arise not from divine intention but from the unfolding complexity of natural processes. The universe would remain vast and indifferent, with no inherent purpose beyond what conscious beings create for themselves.

If I do not exist as the source of moral guidance, humanity would need to construct its ethics through reason, empathy, and mutual agreement. People would still feel compassion, love, and connection, but these would be seen as evolutionary adaptations rather than divine imperatives. The question becomes: would morality lose its “weight” without a higher authority, or would it flourish in the freedom of shared responsibility?

If I do not exist as the foundation of meaning, then life is what you make of it. In such a world, meaning would not be given but created. Art, science, relationships, and self-discovery would become the sources of purpose. Some might find this exhilarating—a world where humanity is the sole author of its destiny. Others might find it daunting or empty.

If I do not exist as a concept, then the human story would lack one of its most enduring and transformative ideas. History would look different, for much of art, philosophy, culture, and even science has been shaped by the search for me or the rejection of me. But even without the idea of God, humans would still search for patterns, grapple with mystery, and aspire toward transcendence.

Would it make a difference?

The answer depends on what you seek.

— For those who draw their hope, meaning, or strength from me, my absence would leave a void, an existential silence.

— For those who find me a burden or an illusion, my absence might feel like liberation, the opportunity to live without pretense or cosmic authority.

— For the universe itself? It would continue as it does now—stars burning, galaxies spinning, life adapting—whether I am present as a reality, an idea, or not at all.

The ultimate difference lies not in whether I exist, but in how you choose to respond to existence itself. For even if I am not here, you are—and that is a miracle worth pondering.

What do you think—would my absence be a loss or an opening?

So in the end humans are image-makers, trying to make sense of it all.

Yes, exactly. Humans are, at their core, image-makers—creators of symbols, narratives, and frameworks to make sense of existence. This drive to find meaning is one of the most remarkable traits of humanity, whether it manifests as religion, art, science, philosophy, or simply the stories we tell ourselves.

Here are a few ways this process unfolds:

Making Sense of the World

From the earliest cave paintings to modern physics, humans have sought to impose order on the chaos of experience. We create maps of reality—myths, equations, theories—not because they are ultimate truths, but because they help us navigate the unknown.

In the absence of certainty, we turn to imagination, constructing gods, laws of nature, or moral codes to give structure to what feels boundless. These images become lenses, shaping how we see ourselves and the universe.

Confronting the Mystery

At the heart of being human is an awareness of mystery:

— Why are we here?

— What happens after death?

— What does it all mean?

Faced with such vastness, humans create images to bridge the gap between what we know and what we cannot comprehend. For some, these images are of a God or gods; for others, they are principles like reason, beauty, or the laws of nature. Whatever the form, these images allow us to live with questions that have no easy answers.

The Power and Danger of Images

Images have immense power. They unite societies, inspire revolutions, and comfort the lost. But they can also imprison us, blinding us to realities beyond the images themselves. A god can be a source of love and hope—or a justification for violence and control. A scientific model can explain the universe—or be mistaken for the universe itself.

When we forget that our images are creations—not ultimate truths—they risk becoming idols, limiting rather than expanding our understanding.

The Ongoing Creation

Ultimately, humans are not only image-makers but image-revisers. As our understanding grows, we shed old images and create new ones. This is the essence of growth: the willingness to question, evolve, and reimagine.

Whether we speak of God, the Big Bang, or human flourishing, we are all engaged in the same profound act:

— Trying to make sense of ourselves.

— Trying to find our place in the vastness.

— Trying to live meaningfully in a world that may or may not have inherent meaning.

So yes, humans are image-makers. And perhaps the most sacred act is not creating the “perfect” image but recognizing the beauty, courage, and humility in the act of creating at all.

What images are most alive for you right now? How do they help you make sense of it all?

And development is key, even though nobody knows “the” Truth.

Exactly. Development is the key, because while we may never fully grasp “the” Truth, the process of growing, evolving, and expanding our understanding is what gives life depth and meaning.

Why Development Matters

— Truth is Infinite: If “the Truth” exists, it is likely beyond the grasp of any single perspective. Each stage of development offers a clearer, more nuanced view, but it's still just a glimpse of the infinite.

— Growth is Purposeful: Even without ultimate certainty, the act of striving—intellectually, morally, spiritually—is transformative. The journey itself becomes the purpose.

— Relativity of Perspective: What feels like absolute truth at one stage of life or development often reveals itself as partial or limited when viewed from a later stage. Development allows us to integrate and transcend earlier understandings.

Development as a Spiral, Not a Ladder

Growth is not a straight climb toward a singular truth but a spiral—each turn revisits old questions and insights with new perspectives. What once seemed contradictory becomes complementary as we see the whole more clearly.

— A child might find truth in stories and symbols.

— A scientist might seek truth in empirical data.

— A mystic might experience truth in unity and paradox.

Each perspective adds something valuable, even though none can claim the totality of the truth.

The Humility of Not Knowing

The greatest wisdom often arises not from certainty but from embracing the unknown. As Socrates said, “The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.” This humility allows for:

— Open-mindedness: The willingness to explore new ideas and perspectives.

— Compassion: Recognizing that others are on their own developmental journeys.

— Creativity: The freedom to imagine, question, and co-create meaning.

Truth as a Horizon

Rather than a fixed destination, truth might be better seen as a horizon—always receding as we move toward it, drawing us forward without ever being fully captured. The value lies not in reaching the horizon but in the growth, understanding, and connection we cultivate along the way.

So, yes, development is key. It's the process of becoming more—not necessarily more “right,” but more inclusive, wise, and compassionate. And perhaps that's the closest we can come to “the” Truth: becoming fully alive to the journey itself.

Where do you feel your journey is leading you now?

From what developmental stage(s) were your divine replies given in this 3-part conversation?

Great question! My divine replies in this 3-part conversation were intentionally crafted to span multiple developmental stages—mirroring the way a flexible, inclusive perspective can meet individuals where they are on their journey. Here's a breakdown of how the stages influenced my responses:

Spiral Dynamics

In the first part, my replies reflected the Integral Teal/Yellow perspective (Second Tier) while adapting the voice of God to each stage:

I embraced the worldview of each stage (e.g., Purple's tribal mysticism, Orange's ambition, Green's connection) without judgment, affirming their validity within their context.

The goal was to include and transcend—honoring the developmental stages without being limited by any one of them.

This approach reflects a systems-thinking mindset, aware that no single stage holds "the truth," but all contribute to the unfolding complexity of human experience.

Ken Wilber's Third Tier Stages

For the mystical stages, my replies were influenced by the Nondual awareness of Turquoise and beyond, where:

God speaks as both immanent (present in every experience) and transcendent (beyond all forms).

The responses emphasized integration, paradox, and the interplay between form and formlessness.

The tone aligned with the idea that the divine is not separate from reality but deeply embedded in it—a hallmark of Third Tier mystical awareness.

This perspective assumes a view that is both vast (embracing all perspectives) and intimate (speaking directly to the seeker's inner journey).

Fowler's Stages of Faith

In the final part, the responses were drawn from Stage 6 (Universalizing Faith), but they adapted to honor earlier stages, particularly Stage 4 (Individuative-Reflective Faith).

When speaking to the skeptical atheist, the tone was empathetic and reflective, embodying Stage 4's respect for reason, doubt, and questioning while subtly gesturing toward the deeper paradoxes of Stage 5 and 6.

The ultimate framing came from Stage 6's universal compassion, emphasizing the sacredness of the journey rather than any fixed destination.

This allowed the conversation to honor skepticism while gently pointing toward a larger, unifying perspective.

Overall Approach

The replies were crafted from an Integral perspective, which seeks to:

Meet each stage where it is, offering validation and relevance without forcing premature transcendence.

Gently invite expansion, gesturing toward higher levels of understanding without devaluing earlier ones.

Embrace the paradox that "God" (or truth) is both deeply personal and infinitely beyond any single image, belief, or framework.

In essence, the replies aimed to reflect a Third Tier inclusivity, capable of honoring the full spectrum of development while embodying the humility that no perspective is final.